BA Super VC10,s retirement compared to BA Boeng 707,s ?

[vc10boy]

Anyone have any info on BA Boeing 707 retirements...and where did they go,what happend to the 707 fleet?...The super vc10 was retired by march 1981 but was younger than the 707 fleet,wonder what kind of hours per airframe BA got out of the 707 compared to the ten...didnt one of the airtours 707 end up derelict in africa?...no second couriers for the 707 fleet i guess..one ended up at cosford with victor mike

[Gwyn]

Hi vc10boy

A total of 7 707-436's went to BA Airtours starting in 1977 and the last one finally retired in late 1981 outlasting the VC-10. Amazing so it might seem the 'one million nuts and bolts flying along in very close formation' as we referred to them as outlived the 'iron duck' as we were referred to as.

Gwyn

[vc10boy]

but the iron duck flew again...only much much longer in her second life...with the raf..The scrap man told me at cosford that it was a bit dodgy walking thru the 707,s cabin due to the bad corrosion,i think he said compared to the 707 the vc10 felt in almost flyable condition..i hopped over the fence at cosford for a close inspection of VM and she seemed in good condition,i looked insde the tail,as it was lying on the deck,and it still had its anti corrosion paint still all intact,got a pic somewhere..

[Gwyn]

vc10boy,

You are absolutely right. It was the economics that brought the VC-10 down not the state of health of the airframe. I can recall flying LHR - JFK full to the brim but at Fred Laker prices and we lost money on the flight.

'VM' went on as a trainer for many years exceeding it's planned life/landings by a wide margin. The RAF ones continued on for many more years but at a lower utilisation that it's BA cousins.

Gwyn

[vc10boy]

Good constructive reply Gwyn..thank you for that,...Would luv to know more about your experience with the VC10 in the BA days,did you serve under BOAC aswell?...

[Gwyn]

Hi Vc10boy,

On the forum I have advertised my book 'with my head in the clouds - part 1' which covers my life up to end of 1979 including BOAC and BA VC-10s. It is out there on amazon.co.uk and a link on the news item will take you straight to it. It is priced at a very economical £15.

Jelle has read it and has written a great review.

The book covers a lot of info on the VC-10 where I was a co-pilot in 1966 to becoming a captain in 1976. Great years - Great aircraft.

Gwyn

[vc10boy]

im going to get it...great days indead...flew mainly kano-rome-heathrow...GARVM,VF, VC ect...full silver service roast beef in first class..,tasted so good after spending alot of time in nigeria....in the end we finally went home by ship...MV Aureol...a beatiful old ship in 1971

[Gwyn]

Hi again,

I remember those flights so well. We also operated 'VC' in Nigerian Airways colours with the green elephant on the tail. They actually bought 'VA' but it ended up scattered all over the jungle very soon afterwards. I got involved in flying out the investigation team and actually visited the crash site. Not nice for a 20-year old to see.

Can I assume that you lived in Nigeria with your family and went to the UK for school.

Enjoy the book.

Gwyn

[petet16]

MV Aureol

[vc10boy]

Gwyn,Thank you for the beautiful pic of Aureol,yes i was out there with my parents,we moved back before the lollipop school flights started,my dad worked for the A.B.U, he met the Emire of Kano i remember..

I went on a bit of a mission to find Aureol in 2000,she was layed up at the bay of eleuses at an island near Athens..she was scrapped soon afterwards,she went to the scapyard at Alang in india under her own power,doxford deisels reliable till the end..i manged to get some elder dempster silverware off her via peter knengo,see maritime matters site..i think the vc10 helped in her demise re lagos run.

Id luv to know more about the the crashsite,but i must get your book,did you take any pics of the wreckage?..i did fly on that nigeria airways aircraft,as i said in a previous post..the nigerian airhostess got my mum to put me under the seat for landing..i was only a baby at the time..

[Gwyn]

Hi there again,

Now there is a story in itself. The Nigerian stewardesses! On the Nigerian flights we a BA chief to keep them in order. In the middle of the night you couldn't find them anywhere until you checked out the hat racks since, in those days, they were not enclosed. The other place to find the girls was tucked up with some first class passenger. In my book I cover the Nigerian scene extensively. As for the crash site the less said the better suffice to say it was all a bit gruesome to a young eye. The inspection team were used to it but I wasn't and it turns my stomach even to this day. No pics I am afraid.

I could imagine being pushed under the seat since it covered all angles for the 'all strapped in and ready for landing, Captain' call. The other problem was that some of our Captains were out of the empire days and treated our worthy friends from Africa with little courtesy. And right in the middle of this lot was me,a single-ringed BOAC Second Officer, learning fast the art of diplomacy.

By the way the pic of the MV didn't come from me. It came from 'petet16'

Gwyn

[vc10boy]

Gwyn,please tell me to stop if im going on too long...but...i see your based in Berlin these days,my 12 year old son lives in the Weissensee area of Berlin,I always book him on BA solo club, last year i got him an origional BOAC flight bag,still in its plastic wraper, so there,s just a little bit vctenderness thats a regular thru terminal 5,and he often gets an invite to the cockpit by the pilot after landing and travels into the terminal with the pilot on one occasion just because of his BOAC flight bag....

[Gwyn]

Now that is a collectable!!

I have seen one or two on E-bay and actually bought one once but it fell apart very shortly afterwards. if I ever meet the seller I will kill him!

I live on the west side in Spandau and travel to the UK on BA since I did 31 years with them and I am very loyal to them.

I feel that we are getting a bit off-topic as our chat goes on.

Besides the NCA might eavesdrop on our conversation and consider us contacting each other in code.

All the best.

Gwyn

[vc10boy]

prob not the sellers fault,very old cavas tends to fall apart,much better repro BOAC bags and Nigeria airways available on ebay for a fixed price,twlve quid..yes lets get back on topic...The 707... flew on them a few times,wngs going up and down all thru the flight,rocking side to side..seemed slow and lumbering?,very bad ear-ache as a child on thoes boeings,was,nt a fan at all?

[Gwyn]

The 707 was built on the different principles to the VC-10 whereby it was designed to flex in turbulence as opposed to the VC-10 which was built to ride out the turbulence being of a more solid construction. The basic weight of the VC-10 was 7 tonnes heavier than the 707. Built out of the solid it was.

I flew passenger on the 707 occasionally and it was quite nerve-racking to see the outboard engine nodding upwards while the inboard engine was nodding downwards. I wondered what was happening was was happening in the wing between the engines.

Back on the VC-10 the only downside to the turbulence question was that, on a super especially, the fuselage would nod up and down and my cup of tea would empty it's contents over the floor. You could categorize the class of turbulence by checking the content loss of tea. Small things pleased small minds you might say.

Give me the VC-10 any time.